Member Dana Nielsen
MemberForum Replies Created
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Cammy! This is such a gem of a song and performance, and love the recording too, nice work!
I listened to your references and I think you are spot on in the sounds and production, and I don’t think it would take much work to get the vocal and rest of mix sounding like those refs. If you feel like DM’ing me a lead vocal stem and an instrumental stem (w the bgvs in it too) maybe I can crank out a quick vid for you and the MP fam here on how I would get it there.
Mostly just taming a bit of low-mid “honk” in the voc with some multiband compression, then some voc wide-band compression, a healthy dose of silky top end (neve, pultec, NTI/maag are a few favs). Then a healthy dose of gentle limiting across the whole mix to get it loud and competitive, without wrecking the natural vibes, just like the refs.
Side Note: at 2:04 there’s a weird pitch rub going on in the band (maybe a tom ringing strangely against the chord being played by the band? Not sure, but maybe you’ll hear it).
Great work on this, Cammy! Is this you singing and/or playing as well?
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OMG @Nate – this is utterly gorgeous and amazing. This whole song, production, mix, EVERYTHING is so. freaking. incredible, you animal!!!
Shoutout to @JLEW who captured my feelings exactly in his first and last paragraphs, so a big phat “DITTO” to what he said.
Here are my verbatim notes I wrote while listening for the first time. As always, take or leave. AND, these are all just musings of my overactive brain, lol. NONE of these thoughts is important AT ALL in any kind of “youuuu should really fix this, Nate” type of way, haha.
2:34 – lose the kicks in “maybe someday” for a nice little dropout
choruses – main “wow” filter juno-ish synth pokes out too much to my ears against the rest of the exquisitely balanced track. It’s possible the level is ok but the stereoizing is making it feel too wide making it pop out too much? [I mostly noticed this in the 1st and 2nd chorus, less so later]
4:12 – breath and noises before choir – I would clipgain those waaay down so the breath level matches the perspective of the outgoing lead vocal – meaning keep the breath the loudness of what your lead vocal singer would sound like in the full chorus mix for a smoother transition.
piano outro – piano might be a bit too loud overall in keeping with the perspective of the massive size of the chorus before it? Or, if u keep it that level, I might try lowering the mechanical thumps and noises, which caught my attention and pulled me out of the trance for a sec as the chorus ended. I know that hyper-macro-lens-thumpy-mechanicals are all the rage in neo-classical Olafur Arnalds upright piano pop trends, lol, and that’s cool, and I love hearing the hammers lift as the final sound of the record!! But my experiment would be seeing if there’s a way to ease into the thumpy mechanics more slowly while keeping the “notes” of the piano at a constant volume. Does that make sense? Like piano sound like this = and thumpy mechanics like this <. Maybe that’s possible with hi-pass automation and/or some RX-ing to turn down the thumps in the front half of the piano outro?
Lastly, I’m so sorry for the loss you experienced which inspired this song. You really nailed that feeling, that emotion, and I can’t think of a better way to honor that relationship than you’ve done here with this magnificent work! 💜
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So hoooooky, bruh!! Another freaking jam, man! Here are allll of the thoughts that occurred to me while I listened (not just the specific thoughts you requested – sorry, I can’t help myself! Take w a grain of salt ..)
2:38 – dying to hear the uh-uh-uh-uh vocal hook here in the breakdown
2:56 – when this post-breakdown chorus comes charging in I want something new to amp up the energy even more, like 16th-tamb and/or triangle pattern, and/or new perc-y loop element
3:14 – same note here as 2:56: bring in something new once the lead vocal ends and the track becomes instrumental party jam. Another new rhythmic element that we haven’t heard before. Could also introduce a new harmonic element too if u wanna go nuts … huge grand piano octave “bass bombs” holding whole notes, or deep e-gtr power chord whole notes
3:17 – uh-uh-uh-uh-uh vocal answer
3:20 – opportunity for a lead vocal tag/refrain of the title, verbed out, “we are animals”
3:26 – uh-uh-uh-uh-uh vocal answer
3:29 – we are animals (with dotted-quarter feedback delay, fading into track fade)
Other general notes (as always, take em or leave em!):
- love the low end
- feel like the mix overall could be brighter and a bit more aggressively poppy mastered
- Do u have a reference mix you’re using for this song? One song that just popped into mind that has a similar breezy summer essence and feel-good chords w synthy poppy textures is “iT” by Christine and the Queens (this link will work even if u don’t have Tidal): https://tidal.com/browse/track/83130513?u
- I found myself getting pulled out of the trance of the music on several little occurrences of minor vocal tuning or vocal alignment discrepancies btwn the two lead vocal doubles, like when an S or a T are flamming. Your vocals always have a very honest, natural, endearing quality that draws me in and makes me feel like I’m getting a true unfiltered treat straight from the source! And I would never steer you away from that essence!!! That said tho, if I were mixing/producing this track I’d prob give those leads a lil 15% nip-tuck in the ol’ pro tools melodyne machine to nudge them ever so slightly toward pop-polish.
Amazing music you’re crankin out, homey!! Thanks so much for sharing here with us!!
PS – @-PT is on a Motorcycle cross-country road trip without his computer and wants you and @JLEW and @Pat to know that he gets alerted that you two have posted here on MP and it’s eating him up inside not being able to respond to your recent posts to cheer you on and offer his sage wisdom!
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Can’t wait to put my ears on this in the studio tomorrow (mon), homey!
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This wikipedia article is pretty dang fascinating if you or anyone else is interested in further reading on the subject of microphones and polar patterns. I had no idea there were such things as laser, fiber-optic, and plasma mics!!! ⚡️🧑🔬🔭🎤
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microphone#Capsule_design_and_directivity
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Jesse! Great questions, and you’re right about the way cardioid and omni polar patterns pick up sound, with cardioid picking up sound from the front of the mic/capsule and omni picking up sound from the front, back and sides of the mic/capsule.
But … it’s important to understand that regardless the polar pattern, these mics output a mono signal. An omni mic WILL capture sound on all sides, giving you a non-directional representation of the room, for example; however, it will be a mono recording of the room … unless you use two or more mics and pan them anywhere other than center.
In the case of an omni mic when we listen to the recorded audio on a stereo playback system, the sound does come out of both speakers but equally so, thus it is mono. One mic – even when in omni, picking up sound from all sides – can never reproduce stereo sound. Gotta have 2 or more mics to recreate the stereo image you hear with your two ears 😉
Does that make sense? I’m realizing while typing just how odd and difficult these concepts are to write about. Much better to demonstrate with sound and/or video! 🤘
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Sweet, Patrick! These are sounding great on my laptop, albeit not the best playback system to really analyze stereo image. That said, on the laptop these sound clear and lively and are a lot of fun to listen to (lifted my spirits, man!). I’ll take a listen on my studio speakers for the stereo image soon.
I’ve been using that ozone imager more and more lately as well – super useful and easy to use, love it!
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So freaking awesome, you guitar-boating stud! Really fun to see the incredible space you were in, and to see a bit of your mic positions. I kept thinking while watching, “wow, where you live is so different from where I live.” Looks sooooo serene and peaceful!!
Fantastic work, homey!!!! Thanks for bringing us on your journey!
Will u do me a favor and also post this vid in your original thread so new visitors there can see your awesome progression and end result in one place? You rule, brother! Keep em comin!
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Is that your bullet hole in that cactus, Paul?? 😂
What an enjoyable SFX-and-tuba-laiden cover! Love the applause and ambulance, and the reverb tail ending was 👌.
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Got the files loaded up in pro tools and sounding great. Which DPA mic is that and where did u place it? That’s got the incredible low end I’m hearing – love it!
I’ve also made some adjustments to the iphone track which balance the image of the ambience and guitar. Hoping to show yall in a vid on monday including also my RX process for multi-mic guitar squeaks 🤘
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💜 thanks man!
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Yes, yes, and YES! I love that you are as mesmerized as I by the mind-warping phenomenon that is RX Spectral Repair. So insane to be able to see music and sound and the relevant harmonics! And it’s even more insane that we’re able to visually adjust the sound, not just look at it. I’m with you man – it’s magic.
The fine folks at iZotope came through with a temporary fix for me to use while they work on a more permanent solution. It seems I uncovered a bug they weren’t aware of. So this past week instead of making videos about RX for you and Mix Protégé, I made videos about RX for iZotope, haha. They were awesome and ON IT, which was very cool and helpful.
I saw that you already released your song and amazing boat video on Youtube, but if it’s cool with you can I still use your guitar tracks for demonstration purposes?
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Hahaha, awe, thanks so much man – I’m so glad it resonated and was as fun for you to read as it was for me to imagine and write down.
And heck yeah – always follow your heart! 💜⚡️🤘
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Sorry no vid yet, Jesse. I’ve been working with the folks at iZotope on a fix for something I discovered while making a vid for you… stay tuned.
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So cool, Paul – I LOVE the a cappella intro and was totally drawn in right away as the production developed. Hearing those bgvs louder was super fun – those are great!
For the heavy guitars, I always wish they could sustain alll the way till the next chord(s) so there were no blank spaces … like, once I hear them I don’t want them to go away! If I had my grubby knob-twisting hands on these tracks I would probably try adding some kind of “sustainer” type plugin or pedal or process on those crunchy cool guitars to experiment with elongating those held chords. Could be done via stretching them or something. I used to use Paul Stretch for this, an old incredible standalone free software that I’m not sure exists anymore. You could stretch a sound out for literal DAYS. Another thing I might try is playing the same part on a couple of new guitar tracks, but letting the strings sustain naturally. Treat those w/ the same type of amp sound and then blend them in with the existing guitars so the original guitars are still there in the mix, untouched, and the new guitars “carry the torch” when the orig guitars die out. Just spitballing ideas here, don’t mind me.
It would also be cool to utilize the accordion after the first instrumental bridge as a pad texture. So we hear it first as the arpeggiated bridge part and then when the next verse starts it turns down a bunch but does paddy chords so that the “new shiny object” introduced in the bridge doesn’t disappear but rather fades into the fabric of the song and arrangement.
~ [INCOMING STORYTIME MIXING ANALOGY…]
I’ve never described it before as such, but sometimes while mixing a song I imagine myself the listener as a guest arriving at a party. I arrive at the front door and it is quiet outside the house (I hit play but the song hasn’t started yet). The first person I meet at the door, the host, says hi and welcomes me into the foyer (the lead singer sings an opening line atop a minimal, inviting ambiance). As I’m led by the host toward the living room we bump into Paula and Travis who’ve just stumbled out of the hallway bathroom. They are loud and drunk and happy, and we all shake hands and hug (B3 organ and background vocals make their entrance .. the song develops). As we move past Paula and Travis into the kitchen I’m greeted by these two bearded lumberjack-looking twins, Ace and Johnny (chorus crunch guitars). Ace and Johnny stay in the kitchen doing Jågermeister shots while the host brings me and Paula and Travis out to the patio where there are a bunch of other partygoers watching a skinny hipster play an accordion (the accordion enters for the bridge turnaround section). Just as the hipster finishes his totally non-ironic ditty, there’s a brief moment of silence before Ace and Johnny suddenly burst through the kitchen door out onto the patio, their voices booming, their flannel lumberjack shirts smelling like hickory smoke. There are now a dozen partygoers on the patio talking, laughing, cheersing, etc (the song is in full swing, heading toward the final chorus)….
The point I’m trying to make is that as I meet people at the party they have my full attention, we’re introduced and chat for a sec – this is like a new instrument entering the arrangement of a song. In the mix, I often turn that new thing UP and draw the listener’s attention toward that new thing. As the song/party ensues and we meet new people/instruments, those people we met earlier in the night don’t LEAVE the party the moment we start a new conversation with someone else … rather, they usually fade into the background ambience. For example, I might go chat with the Accordion Hipster for a moment but in the background I’m still aware of Ace’s booming voice, Travis’ reedy laugh, Paula’s occasional hoots and whistles, and of course the host, who has now fired up a karaoke machine and is absolutely SLAYING “uptown girl” by Billy Joel.
Ok, that was interesting. And amusing, at least for me, lol. Hope that party analogy for mixing was somehow helpful, and keep up the awesome work, @-PT!